Ep. 164 – The Secret Power of SEO

Don (00:00) know, it's, Rob (00:00) Gone are the days of outsmarting the Googles, I think. Don (00:03) I know, I know we used to do you would make the font the same color as your background and then put all your keywords and all your tags on your background right so that visibly it couldn't be seen but it would all be indexed you know by I'm totally dating myself I mean that feels web 1.0 or whatever that but ⁓ all those funny tricks and all that stuff we're done with all that now Rob (00:13) Right, right. Don (00:46) Alright, episode 164, we're back, Rob. We are back. And spring is springing. Pollen is pollening. Rob (00:49) 164. I'm gonna say spring has sprung. Yeah, we've got all kinds of pollen. It's pretty bad, but anyway, we live in Atlanta, so we know this. We still complain about it, but. Don (00:57) Yeah. Yeah, does the pollen, does it really affect you? I feel like it doesn't affect I mean, a little bit, but not not like the rest. Yeah. Rob (01:13) I don't get crazy bad, I'm like a daily, you know, once spring comes, I'm a daily Zyrtec kind of guy. ⁓ But it doesn't, no, I'm lucky. It doesn't, I mean, I get like watery eyes and dry, know, don't mess with your eyes, but not too, too bad. Don (01:18) Okay. Okay. All right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember seeing the kids at like little kids like when our kids were in elementary school, there would be that one poor kid that was just like allergic to everything and just like big eyes and you know, ⁓ just I always felt so bad, you know, for like, it's poor kids, you know. Rob (01:39) Yeah. Yeah, well, Kyler's gets pretty, he's got, there's a lot of sneezing happening. Don (01:48) Is there okay? Lordy. Alright, well we didn't call to we didn't call we didn't start this podcast talk about ⁓ sneezing. Although we could we could probably do an entire podcast on sneezing. ⁓ What are we talking about today? What is our topic? What's happening? Rob (01:51) of sneezing and stuff happening. no no. Today, we're going to ⁓ talk about search engine optimization, which is riveting, which is riveting, riveting. ⁓ And while it might not be the sexiest thing about marketing and advertising, it is critical, dare I say. Don (02:13) the magical world of optimizing. I know. Yeah. It is becoming more and more and more so every time we turn around, it's more and more important as crazy as that sounds, you know. Yeah, it's like it's not the fun part. Let's just be from my perspective, right? There's no art directorial aspect to search engine optimization, right? It's it's its own. It's its own. You know, there's no visualization there, you know, so. Rob (02:30) I think so. It's becoming increasingly so. Yeah, no, it's not. It's not the sexy side of advertising, but it's a very effective side of advertising. And that's the other thing, too, is it's not, ⁓ you know, much of it is just behind the scenes stuff. And then it and then it's a slow burn. It's not like you you do it and all of a sudden, you know, sales go through the roof. Don (03:02) Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's Yeah, it's an interesting conversation to have with clients where it's like, sometimes I just tell them the truth. It might feel like you're pouring money down a black hole because it's going to take a while for it to ramp itself up, right? Because you don't really because to my earlier point, you don't see anything. You don't see stuff. To your point, it's all on the back end, right? And then, you know, you only get indexed every so often, right? Every two weeks or so, right? I mean, depending on how you know, The web crawlers crawl the magical interwebs, know? ⁓ So yeah, so it takes a while to get, but it is also kind of like the magic of compound interest. Like once it starts going, it just keeps going and leveling up and leveling up and leveling up. And it's pretty, it's pretty fun to see the data on the backend and those curves, right? So. Rob (03:33) That's right. That's right. It's pretty amazing. once it starts, once it starts going, it goes. But let's back up for a second. And just for those who may not know, let's talk about what is it? Search engine optimization, what is it? Fundamentally, I guess the way you would distill it down, it's how people find you or your business or your products and services online. Don (03:54) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Rob (04:18) I think that's in a nutshell, is exactly what it is. And ⁓ there's a science to it ⁓ and an ever evolving science to it too, because to your point, Google's always changing and moving and updating and things. And now AI search is in the mix, which is a whole other component of it. ⁓ So it's kind of a battle that's constantly evolving and you're constantly doing new things and trying things. Don (04:36) Yeah. Yeah. Rob (04:46) When I think about search engine optimization, it's like, okay. And there's sort of two primary ways to think about it, right? By definition, there is onsite search engine optimization, and then there is offsite search engine optimization. What's the difference between the two? Great question. Don (05:06) That's a great, I was just gonna ask. Rob (05:08) That's a great question. ⁓ So on-site search engine, easy for me to say, SEO, how about that? We're just gonna go with SEO. On-site SEO is ⁓ what you can do or a business or a company can do ⁓ on their site that they're in control of, right? That they can locally do on their site to help boost their outward appearance ⁓ and ranking. ⁓ Don (05:15) ⁓ There we go. Rob (05:34) There's your business profile. We'll talk about some more of these things, but it's everything you can do internally to your properties, right? Your existing properties that you and your company own to help magnify your voice out across the internet. So that's sort of on-site. And then off-site is how do you, things you can do ⁓ on other people's properties to help them find you, right? Don (05:42) Yeah, yeah. Yep, absolutely. Rob (06:02) is basically how we look at it on-site and sort of off-site. Don (06:05) Yeah. Yeah. And you're using the analogy that like, your website is your digital footprint, your digital little house or your digital real estate, dare I say, right? It's the digital real estate. So which is good analogy to explain to everybody how it kind of works. So yeah. Rob (06:13) Yeah, that's right. That's right. It's your property. I think so. I think so. And so we, know, when we start to think about it for clients, it's like, all right, it lets if it's your house, how are you going to, how do we clean up the house first? What are like, what do we do? You know, and generally speaking, it's, you know, you start with the lowest hanging fruit, which is your, your Google My Business profile, right? So I think the first thing you want to do and that we help companies do is take your business profile. Don (06:37) Yeah, absolutely. Rob (06:42) and make sure it looks and is accurate and as good as it can be. Meaning, are our photos on our, and it may seem like simple stuff, right? And common sense stuff. But we come across a lot of companies that don't do it well enough. And part of that is a problem that either they don't know or B, they don't have time to do it. They're too busy doing stuff for other people. Anyway, so Google My Business Profile, right? That would be step number one. And that's making sure, is my address correct? Don (07:08) Mm-hmm. Yeah. Rob (07:12) Right? Are my pictures good? Are they representative of how I want my business to be seen? Review. Don (07:17) Sure. Yeah. And Google also looks favorably upon you pushing the buttons in their ecosphere. You know what mean? I mean, just you have to play by their rules and do their thing, right? Let alone the emphasis on localization, which I'm sure you'll mention. I won't jump into that. But like, they're not going to do the heavy lifting for you if you don't play by their rules. You got to play by their rules. And they set up these tools to help you get into their system. So, yeah. Rob (07:24) Yes. but they have all the leverage. if you wanna be found, you gotta play by, you gotta do the work. Yeah, so, we always tell you, reviews are a big part of it. mean, Google, fundamentally, what is Google trying to do, right? What is their objective? Google succeeds when they help their customers, you and I, everybody who searches the internet, find the best answers to the questions that people are asking. Fundamentally, that's what Google does. So. Don (07:46) Yeah. Exactly, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Rob (08:11) the more information you can provide to Google that shows that you are a valid company and a valid business, that people who have interacted with your business think favorably of you, and that you are an expert on a particular subject or product or whatever it is, the better Google is going to like you and serve you up towards the top of the page because you become. Don (08:22) Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, they only want to provide information that has relevancy to the questions that people are asking. They don't want to give a dud answers, right? mean, yeah. Yeah. Rob (08:43) No, they want the best answers. mean, that's how that's their business model. The best answers to the questions people are asking. So and reviews are a big part of that. So reviews are always a big one. And that's as simple as, hey, you got to go out and solicit reviews. Right. I mean, people don't. And it's a difficult thing to do. Sometimes you can automate it now. And we do that for a lot of people is automate that, automate that, automate that. Right. Because people generally speaking, and this is not news to anyone, people love to complain on the Internet. Don (08:49) Exactly. I know. It is. Yeah, yeah, well, I was going to say the only time anybody Rob (09:13) Very few people go on and go, hey, you know what? I had an oil change at Jiffy Lube down the street and, you know, Greg was amazing. He was amazing. Car is running great, five stars. ⁓ Don (09:22) Yeah, yeah, exactly. People aren't gonna do that. Yeah. Yeah. That's why like, remember the old, the old like, rate my college professor or something like that, right? You know, or the glass door aspect. It's like, people are only going to go there when they have something to complain about, like, no one's gonna go there and give everybody five stars. That's not how it works, right? So you do have to prompt your customers, hey, give me a review. Hey, give me a review, you know, like, or, you know, yeah, it's important to play by Google's rules in that regard. Rob (09:32) Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's right. And you not to go down in the weeds with it, but it's also important to and Google thinks favorably upon this. you if someone does happen to give you a negative review or negative experience to respond to it, hey, thanks for reaching out. We're working hard to correct it and blah, blah, blah, it is. So that dialogue that the companies have with their customers is important. Don (10:01) Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah, it's like feedback from eBay. Like, if you have 500 transactions on eBay or a thousand, you're going to have some battle scars, right? Like, because the post office is going to lose something. Somebody is going to buy something. They're not going to be happy. Like something's going to happen. That's just the nature of the volume of transactions is important to show that you did everything you could to rectify the situation. Right. And people will look favorably upon that. Right. So. Rob (10:12) Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. Yes, yes. Yeah, Don (10:37) versus like going dark or battling back and forth or whatever. Yeah, it's not good. Rob (10:38) mean, no. You want to be the super host on Airbnb is what you that's what you want to be. You to be the five star Uber driver, the super host, all the things. So so we can talk about that for a while, but that's one component, right? Google My Business. That's the lowest hanging fruit. Let me make sure that's buttoned up. So we always say kind of kind of start start there, right? And then from there. Don (10:44) Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Mm It's crazy. Rob (11:04) you know, it's kind of taking a look at your existing company's site, right? Your website, because that's the other property that you own. And from there, it's everything from, and I'm not going to speak out of turn. I am not the web expert by any stretch of the imagination. Let's make that clear. But ⁓ there are certain practices that you need to content schemas and schema markups and all of these things that you need to do under the hood ⁓ that our developers go in and do and make sure everything is buttoned up under the Don (11:28) Yeah, sure. Rob (11:34) Right? That your site is working properly. You want load times to be fast. You want images to be clear. It's all of those things under the hood of your site. So that everything's working properly and functioning properly. And then also making sure that your site has all of the right information on it. And not too much information, but not too little. And it's just a clear indicator of what you do, right? ⁓ So that's another one too. So you start there and then, ⁓ you know, another thing that you can do is we're seeing more and more the importance of it's everyone's favorite thing to do is write blogs, right? ⁓ And this is where a lot of people lose in SEO because, and I think I would say 90 % of businesses are guilty of somebody came along and said, we should start a blog. And then they went, yeah, that sounds great. Don (12:17) Yeah. Rob (12:30) Alright, Leslie, you're in charge of the block. Well, maybe Leslie goes and gets a different job, or maybe Leslie gets too busy or whatever happens and then all of sudden your last your last blog entry was September 28th of 2023. And it's just gone dormant. Don (12:32) Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I know where you're going with this. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. That's generous. I was gonna say 22. We got an inquiry today literally because of because of our own SEO efforts. The first thing I did was ping the website of where the entrant came from. And I always go to news and events, right, which is which is a blog, let's just call it what it is. And they go, Oh, wow. Yeah, your last entry was 2022. It took you three years to realize, huh, maybe we should reach out to Rob (13:05) Yeah, we see it all the time. Don (13:11) you know, firms to determine how to help us with this type of scenario. You I think that's, you you're dead nuts on it. Once you start that train, you have to keep that going, or you can't stop it because that is a giant roadblock hindrance to SEO efforts. You know, it doesn't show activity. Rob (13:15) Yeah. No. Yeah, Google's going to go, they're no longer, you know. And the other thing too about blogs, generally speaking, is that, this is kind of an offshoot of it, but that's when you become, you know, call it thought leadership, right? Or industry expertise, whatever you want to call it. And that's the way that you show folks, hey, we're on top of the industry, news and trends and things and stuff like that. That's why we're doing this blog. Let's be honest, right? And this podcast, right? Don (13:40) Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Rob (13:55) ⁓ And the problem is, yeah, Google does not like it. You're better off never starting versus stopping and then and then letting it just go dormant for a while. And I think it's like, you know, that's just like any other thing that we're talking about is all of this stuff in a vacuum is not difficult to do. It's just a matter of time and resources. It's finding the time and resources to do it. ⁓ So now there are there are a lot of, you know. Don (14:00) Yeah. Agreed. Agreed. It's finding the time to do it. Yeah, yeah. Rob (14:22) It used to be much more difficult to stay on top of that and to write blogs and things with AI advances and everything we've got and are, you the toolbox has gotten a lot bigger now. And so it's a little bit easier, a little bit easier to implement now. But, but that's a great way to do thought leadership and all those kinds of things is, is, starting a blog and blogs aren't for everyone. Yeah. We wouldn't encourage everyone to necessarily start a blog generally speaking. Don (14:26) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. For sure. Yeah, I'm trying to I'm trying to think about our blogs necessary for everyone. And I think the answer to that is no. Right. I they're definitely our websites and businesses that don't necessarily need to have a bi weekly blog by any stretch, you know. Rob (14:53) Yeah, it. If you're an independent, you know. Bakery right and you make cookies, you know it robs cookies shop. I probably don't need a blog, but I don't need a blog around around cookies. ⁓ But ⁓ you know for. Don (15:02) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I would say in that instance, social as a potential SEO supplement or part of the tool of SEO, right? Would honestly be more important, more of your, you know, stories and reels and ongoing social efforts tying in, right? It's probably more valuable for your little brick and mortar Rob's cookie shop, you know? Rob (15:17) Yes. I think, yes, a combo of social plus SEM, right? Which is just paid search, all your pay-per-click and Google display ads, all that kind of stuff like that. Search and all that kind of good stuff. So blogs can become important. think when there's a, and this is a generalization, but it's probably more important when there's a much broader, there's a lot more competition in a marketplace, right? Don (15:38) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. Mm hmm. Sure. Rob (16:03) ⁓ We do it because there's a lot of advertising and marketing agencies around and we want people to know that we're the best at what we do, right? So that ongoing work I think is good, ⁓ is good to do. ⁓ So that kind of, think that kind of takes care of generally speaking, sort of the onsite stuff. And then, you know, once you have the house in order, once you got your house in order, it's time to invite people to your house. Let's go invite people to come over for the master's party on Sunday. Come on over. It's going to be great. Don (16:10) Yeah, absolutely. Come on over. Yeah. Rob (16:33) So then you can start to move into, you know, sort of the offsite component, which is really, ⁓ you know, building backlinks, right? So the goal is to try and get other valid ⁓ and important ⁓ sites to link to your site. And you do that through, you know, sometimes it'll, it'll, it'll have, if you write a great article, let's say, and somebody finds it, they'll just do it. You don't, there's no payment, there's no nothing. You just become, you know, an important part of their content, right? Because you're reputable. You can also go out and pay for it, right? It's called backlinks. So you go out, you pay influencers to write articles and include you in it and all that kind of good stuff like that. ⁓ So that's, you know, that's generally speaking, I think the primary way to get people to link back to your site, which is incredibly high. Don (17:10) Yeah, of course. Yeah, and that strategy is going to be totally different for Rob's cookie shop versus an industrial equipment manufacturer, you know, make like, you know, like B2B versus B2C. Like there's there's a lot of different factors in terms of what would be, you know, you said it earlier, the low hanging fruit for what that offsite might look like. Right? Not all plans are the same for everybody. So. Rob (17:45) Right. That's right. That's right. And you know, in a perfect world, you're doing this in conjunction with, and by the way, I should mention this, all of this philosophy holds true, I would say, for both B2C and B2B, right? This is not the one, hey, one you should do B2C, one you should do B2B. You know, we're working with a client right now, ReaJet, and they are a manufacturer of industrial printing, basically. Don (18:03) Yeah, agreed. Rob (18:15) ⁓ They print all the barcodes on products and things and stuff like that. ⁓ We are doing a big SEO push for them right now because they want to break into CPG, the consumer packaged goods industry. And so, ⁓ you know, we are churning out blogs with CPG expertise and how they can help you and what they can do and all of this stuff, right? So in that we started, I'm going to have a case study read, that we started in Don (18:36) Mm-hmm. Totally. You're on a roll, man. I love it. Rob (18:44) I'm on a roll, man. We started that, what, three months ago? It's been about three months. And I just had a conversation with them this morning and they are like, we're absolutely seeing CBG leads come in. Like, this is great. This is wonderful. All that to say, you know, SEO is great. You need to layer that then with some advertising, right? You need to then layer that with your digital campaigns, right? Your search, your paid search campaigns. Don (18:57) Amazing. Deal. Rob (19:14) ⁓ So, and we're about to do that actually for CPG for ReaJet too, but I'll get off the ReaJet for now. Don (19:21) Yeah, it's the you need to be kind of, I don't want to say treading water, but you need to be available when they're ready to be looking for you. And then when they do look for you, you need to be able to be found, right? So that's that that's that double prong approach in this instance, you know, Yeah, no, I think that I think ⁓ I think you did a really good job of explaining the two different options and then sort of the the quick low low hitting highlights, you know, I think Rob (19:33) Yes. That's right. That's right. Don (19:49) You know, you mentioned it. Google changes their massive algorithm every eight to 10 months or something, right? We're constantly having to evolve and change based on how they, you know, update their software. We don't own Google. ⁓ You know, and if you think about what we've gone through over the past, you know, 10 years, right? In terms of changing how websites are designed and built and the implementation of SEO, it's really interesting, right? Just how much everything changes. I think... I finally heard for the first time a client the other day say that they Googled something and they went to chat GPT to search for it. Right. And I think and I think that'll be the next big I don't want to say well maybe but like I don't think I think that'll be the next swing right in terms of what SEO looks like. Right. Because it was hey we all used to go to like you know Yahoo or whatever then we all went to you know Google. Rob (20:29) yeah. Don (20:48) Then it was interesting when YouTube got big enough that people were using YouTube as a search engine. I'm looking for how to do something, like how to thing, or how do I rewire this something. I'm not searching for it online. I'm going direct to the video repository of the world, YouTube. So I think it'll be really interesting as AI is ⁓ clearly never going away. When consumers... start to fragment on when do I go to YouTube to ask a question versus when do I go to AI? Yeah. Rob (21:21) Well, it's already happening. I mean, you when you ask anything on Google and the AI is now the first thing that comes up. So you're certain. Don (21:26) Yeah, well Google's AI version, but I mean like you bypass Google entirely and you go to Claude or you go to chat GPT or you go, know that type of. Rob (21:35) I think I think you know what we're doing now too with clients, Riajett and others is there's a whole new and again I'm not Nick, our SEO expert can can talk in depth about this if you want to call us to talk about it. But we're also there's a there's a whole ⁓ offshoot of development specifically for AI search and that's what whether it's Gemini, which is Google's integrated AI search. Don (21:49) Hahaha Rob (22:02) or Chad GPT or any of the host of others. And it'll be interesting to see, you know, who survives, right? I mean, just like Google rose to the top, right? It'll be interesting to see which one of these kind of, which ones fall off and who don't. Don (22:10) Yeah, yeah. Well, I'm. I'm I'm I'm treading a little bit above my pay grade, right? But Google has their own AI interface through Gemini and serves you AI results, right? But we all play by Google's SEO rules, but Google also knows when the content is AI generated as well, right? And you know, there will be a point where you you're not delisted by any stretch of the imagination, right? But. you are you harmed by utilizing AI generated content to, you know, supplement human content on your site, right? Will Google look down upon that even while they are pushing their own AI out, right? I mean, I think that that'll be an interesting battle in frontier as well, you know? Rob (23:04) Well, here's what I think. ⁓ I don't think companies will be delisted for using AI content because I think most every company is going to start using AI content. I think it'll just be the more general. it good? Are we asking the right questions? Are they providing the right information? it, you know, if it's overtly, I mean, yes, there will be bad AI content, all of it. Don (23:23) Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, there is right now. Rob (23:33) And it'll be filtered out by this is really shitty content. Like, you know, it's because, because, and I'm going off on a tangent, but AI is, Don (23:37) Yeah, yeah. Rob (23:45) It's all about in broader terms, knowing how to use the tool and ask the right questions and do the right things. Right. And we're still, I don't want say we're in the infancy, but we're still very much in the infancy at the same time. Don (23:50) Yeah, correct. We are, we are. I think the mission critical aspect of the AI content that I think that a lot of people overlook is that, ⁓ and we've all seen these anecdotally social media videos of the guy talking to chat GPT and this and that, right? Or Sam Altman's response to all those things. I've been watching, you know, I've been watching those videos. Those are fascinating where he's watching other people utilize, you know, the fifth version, right? But it won't, I think what's interesting and how this might tie into SEO and Google, right, is that you'll never have chat GPT admit that it's wrong. Like as of right now, it will never say, I don't know the answer to that. It just makes something up or says something different, right? Which is interesting, right? But Google in its infancy, right, or search will say, hey, there are no results for that. Like there are instances where it's like, Rob (24:44) Yeah, yeah, you're never going to get that. I don't know. Go ask him and I. Don (24:54) You're looking for something and it doesn't exist, right? But AI right now won't do that. It will just go, yeah, the answer is 10. You're like, what? are you talking? know, like that's, you know, so there's interesting aspects to, I'm not trying to point out that parts of it are broken. I think to your point, it is in its infancy. It will get there, right? But it doesn't say, hey, I'm unable to do that right now. It just will not do that. Like it's not baked in to do that, right? ⁓ So that kind of flies in the face of Rob (25:11) What? Right. Stubborn. Yeah. Don (25:25) I'm searching for something and you know, you're not giving me proper results, right? I mean that and that that is Google's mission as you identified at the beginning of this podcast, right is to give the most relevant thing. So I agree with you. I don't think I don't think they're going to delist anybody like how Google went through that phase where you're trying to game the system with meta tags and you're trying to cheat the system or we worked with that franchise and they got remember the two men in a truck, right? They were delisted because they Rob (25:38) That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Don (25:54) built microsites for every one of their franchise locations, but use the exact same content on all like, you 200 to 300 of those sites. And Google looked at that and said, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, you're trying to game the system by having 300 sites all say the same thing. And they're like, to the back of the line, right? So I don't think that's going to happen because of AI, but it is interesting that Google on the backend will authenticate if this is AI generated content or not. So the question is, what are they going to do with that from a search perspective? I don't know. Rob (26:00) Right. Yeah. Don (26:24) We'll see, you know, but that'll be the next big frontier, I think. Rob (26:25) We'll see. But yeah, I mean, everyone used to just try and game the system. You're right. ⁓ Even down to like, and they still ⁓ your business profile. You can't just make it. You have to have a physical office or a physical. I mean, they're back in the like, we're going to mail you a post. Like someone has to get it like it has to be verified. Don (26:42) Dude, those days are over. You have to submit videos of a walkthrough in your office now to prove that you are who you are, you know, it's, Rob (26:47) Yeah, Gone are the days of outsmarting the Googles, I think. Don (26:52) I know, I know it's it's ⁓ it's interesting. I know we used to do we used to do you would make the font the same color as your background and then put all your keywords and all your tags on your background right so that visibly it couldn't be seen but it would all be indexed you know by I mean now I'm totally dating myself I mean that feels like web you know web 1.0 or whatever that but ⁓ all those funny tricks and all that stuff we're done with all that now you know so. Rob (27:05) Right, right. Well, I think just to wrap it up in a nice little bow, the point is we've been doing SEO for quite some time now. Back to those days of hiding things and whatever else. But it's an ongoing critical part of your business ⁓ if you want to be found. And increasingly, there's more and more and more more more competition every single day. So it's critical to do. We do it for a lot of folks and a lot of different types of businesses. So this is my sale. Don (27:25) Yeah, Yeah, yeah. It is. I know and I think important to note that we can do an SEO audit for you as well, right? Rob (27:52) ⁓ yes. Dare I say free of charge? ⁓ Don (27:55) Yes, free of charge ⁓ SEO audit. Where can people contact us to get that free of charge ⁓ SEO audit Rob? Rob (28:00) Let me, one more thing on that mini audit. And why do we do that? That's crazy. Here's why. Because SEO, I think to a lot of folks is this daunting, know what it is, but I don't really know what it is. I don't really understand it. And because it is such a behind the scenes sort of event, it really helps for us to do an audit and crawl sites and show you via graphs and via real data. Don (28:13) Yeah. Yeah. Rob (28:28) Hey, here's exactly what's happening. It's also very, very helpful from a competitive standpoint because we always include that in the mini audit too. It's give us your top four competitors and we'll put you against them. So that's really helpful for people. like I said, we'll do that free of charge. If you're interested in that, just reach out. But where can the people find us? Go to Google. Yeah, you can find us of course on the internet. mocktheagency.com. ⁓ We're everywhere these days. Don (28:39) Yeah. Yeah. Good point. Ha We're everywhere. everywhere. Yeah. All right, we'll talk to you next time. Yeah, we'll be back for 165. We'll see you next time. Toodles. Rob (28:59) And we love SEO, so reach out and we'll talk to you for 165. Thanks.